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Old 02-16-2008, 05:31 PM   #1
mriparian
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Something New
Learning Anything New?

I've picked my guitar back up, determined to teach myself a ton of new chords. I only know the basics, certain barre variations (7, m7, m), and a few weird ones.
To help to that end I'm learning to play You Go To My Head, which uses a lot of chord shapes I'm unfamiliar with, as well as a lot of barre variations I've never seen before.
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Old 02-17-2008, 09:35 PM   #2
Ratt In Clothes
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I've been working on my comping too. My single lines are fine, but I've been discovering that nobody really wants to play with you unless you're better than the next guy at comping. Mainly right now it's chords made of fourths instead of thirds, as well as connecting the inversions of some of the weirder chords up and down the neck.

If you're really getting inside those seventh chords, here are some diagrams that helped me a while back to figure out how exactly to make 'em:


Only dominant sevens though, so those only work over V chords.
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Old 02-17-2008, 09:52 PM   #3
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Oh man, thanks!
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Old 02-19-2008, 04:29 AM   #4
monkfish79
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http://www.xs4all.nl/~hippy/chords/

Should be a few new ones here!
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Old 02-25-2008, 03:24 PM   #5
Roivas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratt In Clothes
I've been working on my comping too. My single lines are fine, but I've been discovering that nobody really wants to play with you unless you're better than the next guy at comping. Mainly right now it's chords made of fourths instead of thirds, as well as connecting the inversions of some of the weirder chords up and down the neck.

If you're really getting inside those seventh chords, here are some diagrams that helped me a while back to figure out how exactly to make 'em:


Only dominant sevens though, so those only work over V chords.

A chord with a major 3 and minor 7 doesn't have to be limited to a dominant/tonic function.

In addition to the V, "minor/major 7" chords appear "naturally" (I won't use the D Word) on the IV and VII in any minor key. Any scale degree can be used as a "secondary dominant"...or you can just use "G7" anywhere else.

IV (with raised 6th degree): D F# A C
V (with raised 7th degree): E G# B D
VII (in natural minor): G B D F

This chord on the tonic (I7) is very common in blues and jazz.
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Last edited by Roivas : 02-25-2008 at 07:33 PM. Reason: III??? WTF???
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Old 02-26-2008, 11:42 AM   #6
Ratt In Clothes
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I know dude. But I wasn't going to dump on somebody who's only just learned the barre positions for seventh chords with all kinds of esoteric terminology. If you have a tangible departure point (as in seeing the relationship between the fudging of what we see as diatonic harmony with those altered tensions and the V chord) it's easy enough to apply the concepts to other areas. So rhythm changes, the conversion of chords in a blues progression to dominants (which I use as opposed to the min/maj7 espoused in Kostka's publications, as it generates confusion when referring to the Harmonic or Melodic minor tonic), secondary doms, as you said, etc... Basically, ideas employable anywehere you see a dominant and you're in in charge of the harmony.

If you're in a big band or rock setting, however, where your bandmates can't neccessarily adapt or the harmony has been written out, it's best not to frig around too much with what's written. That's why I wrote it that way, just because it's difficult to figure out the whole application without testing the restrictions first.
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Old 02-26-2008, 02:45 PM   #7
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I wouldn’t want to overload a beginner with abstractions either, but I think you can avoid this and the spreading of misinformation at the same time.

Following your logic, how would a beginner strumming his first barre chords know what a V function is anyway?

It should be maj/min 7 for a dominant seventh-like chord. Sorry.

What do you mean by this?:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratt In Clothes
(which I use as opposed to the min/maj7 espoused in Kostka's publications, as it generates confusion when referring to the Harmonic or Melodic minor tonic)

I wouldn't have the slightest clue what terminology Stefan Kostka uses as I tend to stay away from generic college textbooks. Are you saying he invented this particular chord naming scheme?
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Old 02-26-2008, 09:55 PM   #8
Ratt In Clothes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roivas
Following your logic, how would a beginner strumming his first barre chords know what a V function is anyway?
The first progression I ever learned was the twelve-bar blues, which my teacher told me was a I-IV-V. I didn't mean to be obtuse, I just thought it was common.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roivas
It should be maj/min 7 for a dominant seventh-like chord. Sorry.
In a perfect world, yes. Trying to have a conversation with somebody in reference to both min/maj7s and maj/min7s is tedious as hell though. My casual conversation is rarely if every exam-worthy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roivas
I wouldn't have the slightest clue what terminology Stefan Kostka uses as I tend to stay away from generic college textbooks. Are you saying he invented this particular chord naming scheme?
No, merely that it is espoused by Kostka.
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Last edited by Ratt In Clothes : 02-27-2008 at 10:06 PM.
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Old 02-27-2008, 10:58 AM   #9
Roivas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mriparian
I've picked my guitar back up, determined to teach myself a ton of new chords. I only know the basics, certain barre variations (7, m7, m), and a few weird ones.
To help to that end I'm learning to play You Go To My Head, which uses a lot of chord shapes I'm unfamiliar with, as well as a lot of barre variations I've never seen before.

Get a good Beatles sheet music book with fret diagrams written over the music. George Harrison used a lot of relatively weird chords for his time.
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Old 02-27-2008, 11:58 AM   #10
Roivas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratt In Clothes
The progression I ever learned was the twelve-bar blues, which my teacher told me was a I-IV-V. I didn't mean to be obtuse, I just thought it was common.

In a perfect world, yes. Trying to have a conversation with somebody in reference to both min/maj7s and maj/min7s is tedious as hell though. My casual conversation is rarely if every exam-worthy

No, merely that it is espoused by Kostka.

Cool.

Are you in school for music?
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