Rock and Roll HOF....as in the 2008 Edition - Page 3

Satchmo8101 · 10-02-2007, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team-Rancho

@Satchmo: It's GREY not GRAY, just as it is T/R not T-R.

It can be Gray or Grey and it's T-R.

TheZola · 10-02-2007, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team-Rancho

@Satchmo: It's GREY not GRAY, just as it is T/R not T-R.

@Zolaman: How would you define or describe that specific sound? That sound/style/image constantly changes. For instance in 1987 Hysteria was the most anticipated and also best selling rock album, ten years later nobody would've cared for nor bought the same release. We really needn't discuss Britney, X-Tina nor Madonna (who is GREAT btw). These are acts who barely write anything themselves, who were for the most part created by certain major labels with the sole idea behind it being a financial profit or commercial success. And even they will have to change should the mainstream require it.
It gets difficult with a band like Kiss. They always wanted to make money off their music, the more the better. But they still did all their stuff by themselves, and you can't argue that they've always loved recording and performing their music. I'm not sure if commercial success was their main objective, at least after Alive I.
And as far as Led Zeppelin goes, Jimmy Page somewhere said that he seriously anticipated his band's commercial success, even at that level.

To me you can isolate and label a certain style of music commercial only in a musical era in which that particular style is popular.

I defined the sound in my previous post.

No one in the mainstream caring about an album like Hysteria in 1997 is simply due to evolution. Honestly, it didn't take ten years for the main stream to forget about Hysteria, it took only five. There are very few past artists (dead or alive) who could have new releases now and find mainstream success with it.

Kiss has used everything from dolls to blankets to cereal to sell their music. That made them a product, not a band. The music was secondary, and therefore their music is mediocre at best. Their appeals to a specific market were different and therefore they are in a category all to themselves.

Keep in mind, when I'm saying commercial here I'm referring to the conscious appeal to a market in order to gain popularity and therefore money from doing what that market demands. I'm not talking about making music that becomes popular.

Also remember, there have been times, brief shimmering moments, when the popular music was also the best music available.

Seerix · 10-03-2007, 03:49 PM

Afrika Bambaataa should get in, but the fact that he won't and Johhny Cougar will says all that needs to be said about the "Hall of Popularity."

Rock rock planet rock....don't stop

Team-Rancho · 10-04-2007, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheZola

I defined the sound in my previous post.

No one in the mainstream caring about an album like Hysteria in 1997 is simply due to evolution. Honestly, it didn't take ten years for the main stream to forget about Hysteria, it took only five. There are very few past artists (dead or alive) who could have new releases now and find mainstream success with it.

Kiss has used everything from dolls to blankets to cereal to sell their music. That made them a product, not a band. The music was secondary, and therefore their music is mediocre at best. Their appeals to a specific market were different and therefore they are in a category all to themselves.

Keep in mind, when I'm saying commercial here I'm referring to the conscious appeal to a market in order to gain popularity and therefore money from doing what that market demands. I'm not talking about making music that becomes popular.

Also remember, there have been times, brief shimmering moments, when the popular music was also the best music available.

Well, you're definition wasn't that precise. "Easy on the ears...radio friendly...Top40 music", those characteristics change (or as you said 'evolve') from time to time. I thought you might define commercial through a specific album.
I'd say that Hysteria would've been a good example for commercial music, if only for the era of the late 80s in North America. And BTW, while in '92 Adrenalize only hit double platinum or so in America, it outsold Hysteria in Europe. So the term commercial also varies from region to region. In Japan 80s rock was still big in the late 90s, I've heard somewhere.
As for Kiss being only a mediocre band, well, I'd agree if you limited it to the original lineup. The unmasked Kiss (better: "The lineup without Criss/Frehley") were alot better musically, even though they didn't sell as much.

Satchmo8101 · 12-13-2007, 05:52 PM

The final cut....

Madonna
John Mellencamp
Leonard Cohen
The Dave Clark Five
The Ventures

Little Walter in the sideman category.

Kenny Gamble and Leon Huff in the non-performer category.

jazzfromhell · 12-13-2007, 06:45 PM

Obviously, Mellencamp making it in over the Beastie Boys and Afrika Bambaataa (nevermind the Stooges not getting nominated again) is a total joke. Other than that, I'd have to say it's a solid list. As much as I hate Madonna, when you're talking about a Hall of Fame, she kinda deserves to be there.

TheZola · 12-13-2007, 08:03 PM

Little Walter!

Team-Rancho · 12-14-2007, 07:10 AM

Madonna rules.

Seerix · 12-15-2007, 10:43 AM

Yay Johnny Cougar.

Madonna getting in was inevitable and obvious. The Hall recognizes people that move mass units more than people that actually influence music, particularly when they have to pick from between the two. I don't respect Madonna's musical "contributions," but I do respect her as a career strategist. At one point I thought she had pigeonholed herself too far in one direction, but she has proven me wrong several times over. As the Hall has come to define itself, leaving Madonna out would have been wrong.

TheZola · 12-15-2007, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seerix

As the Hall has come to define itself, leaving Madonna out would have been wrong.

Well put.