Sea Change v. OK Computer - Page 4

chrisarclark · 04-15-2005, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orpheus

both are not that terribly eclectic...

now cmon- relatively they certainly are, especially relative to their contemporaries.

TEMPTED · 04-15-2005, 07:24 PM

I think people, me included, say radiohead sounds forced because when they started out, it wasn't anything special. good music, but not anything profound. and like all of a sudden, they have a thing for orwell and computers and manufactured products. its like they no longer wanted to be just pop or just rock and wanted to do something else. but its not something innate. you know what I mean? like beck was out there to begin with. and you've said it before and probably will say it again, what's wrong with radiohead doing that?

nothing. thats cool, I'm all for them making good music. from the beginning till now, beck continues to be different and have a unique sound and make albums as goofy as odelay to albums as beautiful and epic as sea change. and still make good music that people like and enjoy.

Orpheus · 04-15-2005, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisarclark

now cmon- relatively they certainly are, especially relative to their contemporaries.

well opposed to most mainstream alternative acts they are, but what they've done has never been that out there...

Radiohead shift from Ok Computer to Kid A was a good one and for me a surprising one at the time, but now that I've heard some more music and also some of the acts that inspired them to make Kid A, I'm not that amazed by it anymore... they added an electronic layer, but they never really left the altpoprock area...

I can say less about Beck, because I know his work less good, but he seems just very smart in taking bits from some other artists, without doing something really new himself... Mixed Bizness for example, is just a white, more alternative version of what Prince did ten years before... ok his pseudo rapping may have been something new, I'm not sure about that...

anyway, is their anything that they've done that's really outside the altpoprock vein? I don't think so really, so that's not thàt eclectic...

chrisarclark · 04-15-2005, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TEMPTED

if you think Sea Change is conventional, you are mistaken. ok I guess you could make the argument that for beck who's copping mainly black and latino genres (and also folk and country and psych) and is already experimental to begin with to ditch all of the genre hopping and actually focus is conventional. but thats a dumb argument and you're still wrong. its the exact opposite.

as for radiohead, incredible progression? say what? kid a and amnesiac seem to me to be the only real experimental progressions they ever did. everything else, the sound is just rock or pop music.

and as for achieving success, I think its pretty obvious beck is popular also. in fact i'd say he's more popular.

Sea Change is certainly a conventional album. its basically a straight up folk-tinged indie album and thats one of its greatest strengths- its simplicity is key.

now, im not saying that Radiohead is always breaking new ground musically [if they are ever], but up until Hail To The Thief they were consistently breaking new ground for themselves. for most of their career theyve travelled up a very steep ascension while Beck has been doing the same closed circuit.

and ididnt mean commercial success or popularity- imeant artisitc success. even if we were talking popularity, Radiohead is obviously more popular. theyve sold far more albums and played to far more people. The Bends, OK Computer and Kid A are regularly refered to as being amongst the greatest albums of the past ten years, while Beck basically only ever gets mentioned for Odelay- rarely for Sea Change.

TEMPTED · 04-15-2005, 08:21 PM

I agree it is a folk-tinged, simple at first listen I guess, indie album. but more than that, its the emotion. in the last decade, it is the best breakup album.

and if you mean conventional by nothing groundbreaking, how many albums recently have come out with that kind of intensity? I can't think of any. I just don't see how you think beck isn't challenging himself or expanding his art by making Sea Change. i'd say exposing that much inner grief and laying out something so private so beautifully is challenging enough.

Orpheus · 04-17-2005, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TEMPTED

I agree it is a folk-tinged, simple at first listen I guess, indie album. but more than that, its the emotion. in the last decade, it is the best breakup album.

and if you mean conventional by nothing groundbreaking, how many albums recently have come out with that kind of intensity? I can't think of any. I just don't see how you think beck isn't challenging himself or expanding his art by making Sea Change. i'd say exposing that much inner grief and laying out something so private so beautifully is challenging enough.

Bonnie "Prince" Billy's Master & Everyone is one that comes to mind...

chiron · 04-21-2005, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orpheus

both are not that terribly eclectic, both are pretty good... though Ok Computer seems to have had a bigger impact on music than Sea Change, it's perferctly possible to like it better than Ok Computer... most people just think about which one they enjoy more... you Chris look also at what most people think (well at least when you agree with what most people think)

I could imagine how some people would find Ok Computer cold, yet I find it very emotional and touching... I guess I like that "cold sphere"... it doesn't seem like a boring album at all... yet the indie snob in me thinks that there's way too much talk about Radiohead and that besides the fact that there's so much other music out there has prevented me from listening to any Radiohead in a long time...

although I like some of his tracks, I've never been that much into Beck... and while the songs that I've heard from Sea Change were enjoyable and sometimes even quite touching, there didn't seem to be anything really remarkable about the album... just another folky indie pop album... and there are many that mean much more to me, often because of personal reasons...

I totally agree.
While I can understand why Radiohead is so highly rated there is I can't hear anything at all special about Beck's album.
And tempted, I could list at least at least 10 indie/alt. rock albums that in my opinion have more 'emotional', 'lyrical', 'experimental' qualities than Sea Change, but I won't since that would probably just prejudice your mind to some really decent albums.

Frost · 04-21-2005, 01:31 PM

Of course. While I don't always work like this, a lot of the time I'll judge an album based on my first listen. The first time I heard Ok Computer, I was floored. Conversely, the fist listen I took to Seachange made me want to take a nap. Of course, my musical tastes have eveolved since, so I might appreciate Beck more now, but at this very moment I'll still say the Radiohead disc wins.

Orpheus · 04-23-2005, 03:52 PM

I listened a few times to Sea Change today and I can't say that I was greatly impressed... a few good songs, but nothing really exceptional... if he really aimed for an emotional record he had better leave out much of the orchestrations and keep it to guitar and voice basically... can't say that I've ever been a big fan of Beck though... I like some of his songs, but that's all...

Staley-Cobain · 04-23-2005, 04:23 PM

I'm not going to lie. Both of these album are the top for both bands on my list. Though I loved Amnesiac by Radiohead a bit more for some reason. Sea Change is a phenomal album by Beck. It really got me hooked on his extreme changes in each album. Sea Change is my pick. I love each track as much as Radiohead's OK Computer, but I'm leaning with Sea Change