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11-30-2004, 11:00 PM
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#21
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He...Who Drops Knowledge
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Originally Posted by Floydian
I would actually consider Dolphy more Avant. I would consider Braxton & Lacy free to some extent. Have you heard Steve Lacy's Moon or The Forest & The Zoo? Those present his more free moments. As for Braxton, a few of his albums would be considered free, have you heard his duos with Derek Bailey? They aren't the greatest, but they are fair. Paul Bley could be considered free on certain moments such as his trio performance with Evan Parker & Barre Phillips or with Jimmy Giuffre & Steve Swallow.
I'll cease at this point... :P
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Dolphy like Coltrane played both avant and free jazz, but not free improv. Lacy and Braxton are avant. Both write/wrote out compositions in detail, which is not part of Free Jazz. Evan Paker wanted his duo recording with Braxton to be a Free Improv, but Braxton was not having any of that. He showed up with music he had written out.
Paul Bley is generally avant, except for the a few recordings.
Last edited by Satchmo8101 : 11-30-2004 at 11:11 PM.
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11-30-2004, 11:01 PM
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#22
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what PLANET is this?
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Lincoln Head City
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Originally Posted by Seba
Come on, Digger...don't spoil the fun...  |
o.k. I'll nix that idea.
But I warn you.
I'm inventing new genres even as we speak!
__________________
Don't lay your hang-ups on me, man!!!!
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11-30-2004, 11:01 PM
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#23
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forumkiller
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: GA, USA
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Originally Posted by Digger
I'm inventing new genres even as we speak!
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I'm cool with it as long as you record your results and share them...
I'm interested now! 
__________________
"[John McCain] will make Cheney look like Ghandi" - Pat Buchanan
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11-30-2004, 11:02 PM
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#24
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what PLANET is this?
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Lincoln Head City
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I call it quasi-avant!
__________________
Don't lay your hang-ups on me, man!!!!
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11-30-2004, 11:04 PM
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#25
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forumkiller
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: GA, USA
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Originally Posted by Digger
I call it quasi-avant!
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That's probably a good label for 75% of the shit I listen to most of the time... 
Anyway, what were we talking about?
__________________
"[John McCain] will make Cheney look like Ghandi" - Pat Buchanan
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11-30-2004, 11:08 PM
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#26
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He...Who Drops Knowledge
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You could call all these Free Jazzers. In some cases it depends on what period of their recording career.
John Coltrane
Cecil Taylor
Eric Dolphy
Albert Ayler
Ornette Coleman
Joe McPhee
Mats Gustafsson
Evan Parker
Andrew Cyrille
Sun Ra
Don Pullen
Roscoe Mitchell
Jimmy Lyons
The Art Ensemble of Chicago
Ganelin Trio
Italian Instabile Orchestra
London Jazz Composers Orchestra
World Saxophone Quartet
Peter Brotzmann Chicago Octet/Tentet
Those that you can call Avant, also in some cases, it depends on what period of their career.
John Coltrane
Cecil Taylor
Eric Dolphy
Charles Mingus
Anthony Braxton
Steve Lacy
Sun Ra
Don Pullen
Paul Bley
Elvin Jones
World Saxophone Quartet
Those you can call Free Improv
Cecil Taylor
Mats Gustafsson
Evan Parker
Andrew Cyrille
Roscoe Mitchell
The Art Ensemble of Chicago
Ganelin Trio
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11-30-2004, 11:38 PM
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#27
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Reckless Libertine
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Just out of curiosity, how improvisational are these recordings the tenth time you listen to them?
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"I am bifercated to the proper mode of communication"...NWA
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11-30-2004, 11:46 PM
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#28
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forumkiller
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: GA, USA
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Originally Posted by algernon
Just out of curiosity, how improvisational are these recordings the tenth time you listen to them?
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To tell you the truth, the great fun of improvised music is that there's always something new to be discovered, no matter how many times you've put on the record...the greatest free jazz / free improv recordings can consistantly take you to new places every time...it really never gets old! In this respect, it's a uniquely improvised performance every time it enters your mind...
...of course, this is different for everyone, but that's how I feel about it anyway. 
__________________
"[John McCain] will make Cheney look like Ghandi" - Pat Buchanan
Last edited by Seba : 11-30-2004 at 11:50 PM.
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12-01-2004, 02:59 AM
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#29
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As Serious As Your Life
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Cuckooland
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Originally Posted by Satchmo8101
Dolphy like Coltrane played both avant and free jazz, but not free improv. Lacy and Braxton are avant. Both write/wrote out compositions in detail, which is not part of Free Jazz.
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Lacy's "The Forest & The Zoo" lacks detail. I would consider that one & as I meantioned previously "Moon" as free jazz.
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Evan Paker wanted his duo recording with Braxton to be a Free Improv, but Braxton was not having any of that. He showed up with music he had written out.
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Are you refering to "Duo (London) 1993" relased on Leo Records? Braxton & Parker have dueled in a complete free setting during the Company Weeks.
Regards,
Alexander
__________________
On A Dilemma Between What I Need & What I Just Want
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12-01-2004, 03:17 AM
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#30
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He...Who Drops Knowledge
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Originally Posted by Floydian
Lacy's "The Forest & The Zoo" lacks detail. I would consider that one & as I meantioned previously "Moon" as free jazz.
Are you refering to "Duo (London) 1993" relased on Leo Records? Braxton & Parker have dueled in a complete free setting during the Company Weeks.
Regards,
Alexander
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Those recordings might be free jazz, but that doesn't make Steve Lacy a free jazzer. Yes, I was talking about the Leo release.
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