Ok.. First of all on Music is rotted one note he proves himself to be an excellent jazz bassist and very very influenced by pastorius. You don't think that? play that record to any jazz bassist you know and they'll love it. He's an excellent player.

I am a trained musician (used to be a session bass player) and his compositions are well put together and use a lot of clever jazz transitions.

In short: How about you check your facts before running your mouth off about something you clearly know nothing about.

There are alot of things I could say about you personally, Equinox. But I'll bite my tongue and spare your feelings.

Keef, I was talking about the 'attempted' melodies on track 3-4. The childish, amateur, sentimental melodies that he played. They were tragic. In terms of arrangement his stuff is ok, but musically its not so shit hot. Music is rotted is an abortive attempt at musicianship. None of the musicians I know regard it as anything more then a curiosity. It doesnt stand up to other compositions, hence this thread. I think you are just inflating Tom's importance, the same way that those dummies at his show were cheering for his little 'improvisations' and cheap melodies. When you look at the bigger picture its easy to see that tom aint no musician.

this is exactly why I said "no offense" and made a wink face after my comment. I was joking around. Please, if you have something to say to me, please do it, although it's better to do it via Private message.

When you compare it to the likes of pastorius' first album I'll agree. Because music is rotted isn't an electronic album it's a jazz album and should be treated as such. As a jazz album it's not very wide ranging but to say that there's no musicianship involved is akin to blindfolding yourself saying "there aint no crabs in this pond", and diving face first into a pond full of crabs.

there are some very effective chord substitutions, time changes and very well done and written bass solos in this album. If you disagree with that tell me who did this better (excepting the first pastorius album)

The fact that I even compare this album to the first pastorius one is an accolade in itself.


What bigger picture are you on about here?

Toms bass playing: Tom is an excellent bassist, sure he does the odd trite melody but he also does some great clever jazz runs every so often. I've been playing bass for 15 years, I used to do it session and I stil wish I had Tom's accuracy and occasionally imagination.

** If you say he's a crap bassist, back up your arguments.. Can you do better? Who in the world of jazz improvisation do you respect so you can compare, if no-one then this is an area of music you're not qualified to comment on. It's like a Pink fan saying autechre suck. If Jazz improv isn't your thing you'll never like it.

Toms composing: Ok, his composing can be sporadic but he hits the nail right on the head occasionally like Ultravisitors title track. As to track 3-4 everyone writes a few tracks that suck but not everyone writes tracks that don't.

I'll concede to the following...

Tom could have gone the route of being just a bass player and would have been very respected in his field. Would his compositions have stood up without his bass playing or jazz chops? Probably not to be honest.

The problem is this: Saying you don't like someone is one thing, claiming someone is a non-musician even though theyre a technically excellent bassist, a respected composer and is signed to the biggest label doing the style of music he does is akin not to the pool of crabs thing, it's akin to walking onto planet of the crabs into the crab house of representatives while it's full of crabs, eating crab and shouting to the nearest crab, "Nope, no crabs in here!"

or taking L.S.D...

No shit.

You've confused two different strands of my criticism, Keef. The first strand was that Tom wishes he was a legitimate musician. Meaning that he wishes he wasnt stuck in the mould he created for himself, and Ultravisitor reeks of it. You can actually HEAR him straining to find relevance but then voila you have crap. Maybe hes tired of being labelled as an idm artist, or maybe hes just plain bored and realized that he took the easy route (like people who wanted to be doctors but then flunked out and became dentists, or worse, chiropractors.)

Who do I rank highly amongst improvisors and players? Alot of people, to be honest. Like I said, Tom is just a curiosity but hes no player. Like, for instance, players that I've known and met -- people who have sessioned with (gasp) Ellington, Baker, Coltrane. Guys who have no PRETENCE of being some fantastic artiste, like Tom does. Guys who can actually fucking play, can be thorough about their art, and wont serve you up any ponderous bullshit like Tom tends to foist on his listeners. So fuck him. Bravo.

In terms of Rotted, I think that it was an abortive attempt. I like the idea and I like the feel but it really only has relevance for fans of his earlier work, or for people who cheer at his shows like hyperactive sheep. Thus, although Rotted has its moments and Ultravisitor track 1 was good, Tom is still not a legitimate musician. You youself even concede that if he had tried to make it sans knob twiddle that he wouldn't have been that great at all.

I personally think he's a pussy for not refining his work. I think hes being fashion trendy and trying to reinvent himself but he cant face the clear truth: he is not a legitimate musician.

if Jenkinson never produced his material, it is quite possible that a lot of important music being put out today would have never arrived. his skill is overlooked even by those who go nuts over him. noone will ever replicate his drum arrangements (let alone even attempt using a simple sequencer as he did).

perhaps you'll need to listen closer to what he's doing.

Before we take this any further, I think it'd be refreshing to hear halcyon days explain, in detail, the qualities that make up a "legitimate" musician...

...I'll post my own feelings on the matter later, but I think that much needs to be said before anything else on this subject.

I don't understand why he flies solo on every recording. why isn't he performing
with a live drummer, and along with more instrumentation? I think it's time for him
to open his wings...it's lonely up there alone, i bet.

i am the biggest pusher of the square, and love his stuff...along with (to a certain extent)
ultravisitor, but his latest is dull and monotonous to my ears when it comes down to it.

he's one of those musicians that needs to form a band, and then let's see what
he does...cuz by himself he kicks ass over those beats. i saw him live twice in the
past year and both times, he amazed me. even still (i'm mister back and forth today)
he should open up the sound, imo, and possibly incorporate more musicians.