were Psychic TV considered industrial? or what?

Blimey, thats' a difficult choice, I love all those bands up there. As to the 'are they industrial' debate, I'd say industrial is pretty much a non-sensical term, unless you're only applying it to TG, SPK, or Monte Cazzaza. There's very few artists who had a sound that could be compared to Throbbing Gristle, even Skinny Puppy are as far removed from that as LPD or Death in June.

I'm pretty much a Current 93 obsessive, so they get my vote, with Coil and Clock DVA a close joint second. Dammit, I love almost every band on that list!

Btw, talking of Psychic TV, aren't Sleep Chamber practically a PTV tribute band? It seems strange to have them up there, and not PTV.

I would vote ministry if they were there, why aren't they there again?

On that list I would vote neubauten

this is what I wondered early on in the thread, but they're probably more associated with metal than industrial to a lot of people, but then again, the industrial sound has changed over the years.

Am I the only one that just doesn't "get" Psychic TV? In my opinion, basically everything that Gen P. Orridge has done after Throbbing Gristle is absolutely superfluous. Psychic TV just sounds like boring/mediocre trancey-industrial to me.

what about nine inch nails? aren't they industrial?

In this poll, being in the Avant-Garde/Experimental forum, I wanted to keep it to the idea of Industrial as an experimental rock style: dark, edgy, unnerving, abrasive, chaotic...that said, I felt it should be limited to those "pioneering" Industrial acts that seemed to bring the electronic rock experiments of Krautrock to new extremes during the late '70s and throughout the '80s, what some would consider to be the only true Industrial ever made (( although like most labels, it's a difficult thing to define ))

Ministry and Nine In Nails, to my ears, simply adapted the original ideas of the Industrial pioneers into a more metal oriented context...that said, the Industrial artists themselves merely adapted the electronic experiments of Krautrock (( who lifted from the classical Avant-Garde, etc, etc, etc... )) and fused it with Post-Punk and more Avant-Garde influences, so it could be argued that neither were really Avant-Garde at all, innovative within their respective Genres, yes, but simply playing around with a set of ideas already covered by other more "innovative" artists...

...that said, this poll exists to inspire debate...so feel free...note that I also included "(( other ))" as an option for convenience.

I'd probably agree with you on some levels...but keep in mind, they're important for this reason, at least: they spawned a legion of immitation boring/mediocre trancey-industrial followers in the years/decades that followed...so in one sense, they were true innovators!

Also, keep in mind the time frame of their existence...during the '80s, their sound was still fairly "out there"...maybe not to our ears, but it was fairly unique...

...I'd take TG over PTV any day, but hey, if someone would like to vote for Psychic TV as the greatest Industrial act, who am I to argue!

Seems a strange thing to say. I know Can, Neu, Faust etc, were an influence on some of the early industrial acts, such as Cabaret Voltaire, NWW, and TG, but I wouln't say that formed much, if any, of the basis of industrial music. Krautrock came from a basis of exemplary musicianship, and brought in other influences, such as improv and avant-garde classical, I don't generally think electronics were used that much.
Industrial came more from a basis of non-musicianship, influenced by art groups such as Fluxus, or sound-art/musique concrete techniques. Also, to say they fused krautrock with post-punk, when industrial actually was around at the same time as punk (76/77, perhaps even earlier), seems a little inaccurate.

Good thread though!

You also forget Kraftwerk and Tangerine Dream...and I would hardly say that Krautrock required excellent musicianship...actually, I'd say most Krautrock bands were damned shitty musicians...just really creative!

As far as their influence on Industrial, I never said that every single band labeled as Krautrock influenced industrial, but particularly those that experimented with electronics...not suggesting that this is the only musical precursor to Industrial, but still an important one...


You're probably more on the money here, I was thinking primarily of a lot of '80s industrial which was really little more than Experimental Electronic Post-Punk...which really shouldn't be grouped in w/ what was going on in the '70s...my error!

I think this could turn into an interesting discussion: What is your definition of Industrial music?