When it comes down to it, it's the vocalist that gives that song life. Without them, it's some musical notes written on a piece of paper, and nobody gets any credit for that. Input a great vocalist into the equation, bingo! Now you got something.

Now the songwriter that can sing their own material successfully? Very impressive!

Yeah, shoulda put that in there as well. People that do both are just kicking ass!

That's entirely incorrect. Bernie Taupin is Elton's lyricist...he wrote only the words. Elton is the composer...he wrote only the music.

NDF, you've often told me to stay out of matters I have no knowledge of. Well, it's obvious you have no knowledge at all about songwriting. Songwriting ability is incredibly important. Without it, there would be no songs. There are worlds of great musicians who can't conceive an original musical or lyrical idea to save their lives. They'd have nothing at all to do with their musical ability if there were not those who compose music and create lyrics.

Songwriting is an art form within itself. In the mid 20th century, it was highly respected. Great songwriters and lyricists were often as well known as the people who recorded their songs. Rogers and Hammerstein, George and Ira Gershwin, Cole Porter, Sammy Kahn, Burt Bacharach and Hal David, Jimmy Webb, Goffin and King, Mann and Weil, Holland/Dozier/Holland (and all those great Motown writers), I could go on and on...these people are extremely important to 20th century pop music...it couldn't have happened without them.

NDF, as far as this subject goes, you simply need educatin'...go to school, man...

I don't think you understand my point Reverend, which is regardless of whether a vocalist 'wrote' the song, most contribute greatly to the realization of that song. How can they not? They are singing the song!

Lyrics are part of the songwriting process right? So you are telling me that Taupin ISN'T a songwriter? Taupin was more than simply John's lyricist, he was a songwriter in his own write. I don't think you could tell me that John would have been nearly as successful without Taupin.

Look, NDF, you claimed that Taupin wrote the music, and you're wrong. So shut up already. You don't understand the songwriting process, and it shows.

I think, to be fair, NDF was only making the comment that to actually realise a song's potential, the artist performing the song makes a huge difference towards how the song will sound. There's no dispute over whether Elton John is a talented artist and songwriter, but when you look at how many of his songs are collaborative, you have to ask how different the song would be without Taupin's input.

I've written songs that I didn't think were "right" for my style, so I passed them on to other people. When it comes down to it, whether you like it or not the single most important thing in music is not who writes the songs, but who performs them, because without the link between a musician and his/her audience, a good song goes unheard.

Thanks Reverend, that was a real winning response. I hope you don't take any of these 'people skills' into the church with you.

Monkfish put my point as nicely as I could have said it. I don't know if you just didn't 'get' what we were saying or you think we're ignorant, but you're entitled to your own opinion, and there's better ways of dealing with your frustration.

I understand that you're a professional songwriter, Rev -`and I'm not saying that writers are not important, because they are very important. Let's put it this way, though. Why do classical companies commision recordings from specific artists? Why not just find someone that can play the music proficiently and leave it at that? Why would people rather go and see U2 when there's a perfectly good U2 covers band playing down the road for an eighth of the price? The answer is not because the unheard ofs are any less technically skilled (although you'd actually have to try bloody hard to be less technically skilled than U2, but that's a different conversation......), but because people go back to what they know if they like it.

Like it or not, Joe public doesn't give a crap who wrote the songs that their favourite artists sing. A performer is the last line between your music and a world full of people who, for the most part, just want to see a show.

Yeah, I know. I've just learned over time that using "people skills" doesn't always work with you, so I keep my mallet hammer handy when you and I are debating...