I do know the Skatalites, Maytals etc. and that ska was invented in Jamaica you know, im not an idiot!

But as much as original ska bears little relation to second or third wave ska, i think they should still all be called ska music together. As with everything, music progresses and thats natural. If you want to keep making Return of Django, thats fine, but dont tell everyone else they need to do the same. Thats even more signficant for ska, becuase it's always been all inclusive and based on participation.

Reel Big Fish are as much a ska band as the Skatalites, or The Specials, it just happens ska is a very broad genre!

horakti, why do you think it has to be old and jamaican and bassie to be ska ? okay i can see you dont like modern ska but others do, and it is still ska !

It's the same reason why I don't think Limp Bizkit is hip hop, or Radiohead is electronica, etc. Just because a band's music is influenced by a genre, doesn't mean that it is that genre. Original Jamaican ska and modern American ska-punk sound wildly different. Even the attitudes are totally different. Jamaican ska is spiritual and revolutionary, whereas modern American ska-punk is snotty teen music. (Trust me, you'll grow out of it.) And the people making the music could not be more different. We're talking two completely different cultures here. I think it's disrespectful to say they're the same.

I really think that RadioMute should not have made a separate section for reggae/dub/ska. If they had to create a new section, it should've been named "Jamaican music" (my preference) or maybe "Reggae, etc."

Anyways, no hard feelings people. I'm just defending a type of music that I'm very passionate about. I'm not trying to personally attack anyone.

if you dont like the thread, simple, dont go on it !

When did I say that I don't like this thread? I'm simply discussing music here, and voicing my opinions. Isn't that what this site is about? If my opinions are upsetting you, maybe you should just put me on ignore so you don't have to read my posts.

im not going to do that, i see your point

Yeah, equally as much as i believe Reel Big Fish are ska the Skatalites are always going to be gods, far and away bigger than Reel Big Fish, or anything else new. I just believe also, that in the spirit of inclusiveness nothing deserves to be excluded if they are making ska, which Reel Big Fish (but not Less Than Jake) are.

And ska was never that revolutionary in my opinion, not as much as Roots for instance, but they did make songs about working class problems, which the ska bands today are doing as well. I got an E in my politics exam today, and the RBF song that goes "i've got a funny feeling, were all born to lose" was sharing the sentiment, that i'm working so hard whilst richer people are getting a free ride. And was the music of The Beat or Bad Manners not equally snotty teen music?

And as for culture clash, second wave ska as well is very different to jamaican stuff, the Specials tried to emulate the rude boy style, the same style Dandy Livingstone condemned in his "message to you rudie". And you got to admit, two tone ska still worked, with white kids as well as black!

And i think Rancid_Rocks attack was a bit harsh, i dont want to argue about it. I reckon that if people want to talk about second and third wave ska as well they should be able to, btu we can agree to disagree before it becomes a sticking point.

lol, okay people have different opinions, and i suppose i was abit harsh, lets leave it at that !

Ska was very revolutionary. It may not seem that way if you put it directly next to roots, but for the time, it most definitely was. Ska was born at a time when Jamaica was still a British colony. You can hear the yearning for freedom in those early songs.

Ska was the first uniquely Jamaican music. In the past, Jamaican artists played mostly calypso and R&B, but the Skatalites, Duke Reid, Prince Buster, Derrick Morgan and others created something completely new. It was the national pride of the island, and it announced Jamaica's unique identity in the world.

Listen to "Forward March" by Derrick Morgan for example. It was released in 1962, the year that Jamaica declared its independence from Great Britain, and it perfectly captures the feeling of long-sought and finally-won freedom.

I love second-wave almost as much as I love original ska, but I still think it's far-removed and deserves its own category. Second-wave is more UK punk than Jamaican music, even though it has heavy ska influences.

Anyways, I'm going to suggest to Haakon that we change this to the "Jamaican Music" subsection of "World/Folk" and put "Ska-Punk" in a section of its own under "Punk", then move the relevant threads over there. Whether or not that will happen, I dunno, but I'm going to ask anyways.

I believe Mento is considered the first uniquely Jamaican music. And it also was incorporated into ska and reggae.